In this episode of the Being Well Podcast, Forrest explores how we can harness perfectionism’s strengths without getting captured by its vulnerabilities with therapist and author Katherine Morgan Schafler. They talk about perfectionism’s bad branding, and how our relationship with perfectionism can lead to it being either a superpower or a stumbling block. They discuss the different types of perfectionists, the limitations of defining perfectionism merely as a defense against criticism, and the importance of shifting our language around self-criticism. You’ll learn about the difference between power and control, why self-compassion beats self-punishment, and how to keep perfectionism in check while still reaching your goals.
About our Guest: Katherine Morgan Schafler is a psychotherapist, former on-site therapist at Google, and author of the recent book The Perfectionist’s Guide to Losing Control: A Path to Peace and Power.
Key Topics:
- 0:00: Introduction
- 1:35: Defining perfectionism
- 6:00: Ideals, identity, and asking yourself how and why you’re striving
- 12:40: The five types of perfectionists
- 21:55: Why defining perfectionism as a ‘defense against criticism’ falls short
- 28:20: Changing our vocabulary around self-criticism
- 34:00: Why self-punishment doesn’t work
- 38:10: The difference between power and control
- 44:40: Splitting vs. scaling, and reaching out for connection
- 49:10: When perfectionistic tendencies invade our relationships
- 54:10: The intention that drives real goals, and finding your metric for measuring success
- 1:07:10: Recap
Forrest is now writing on Substack, check out his work there.
